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Suspected fish Disease
05-15-2012, 09:30 AM, (This post was last modified: 05-16-2012, 07:32 PM by Thor.)
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rwzheng1997 Offline
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Suspected fish Disease
I have two goldfish in a tank for a very short while. The tank is very old, taken out of a old garage (same with filter). I used quilt batting for filter media. The 2 inch (with fins) shubunkin goldfish is lively and well. The 1.5 inch comet goldfish is just about dead. Bawling Its not moving, and it doesnt breathe. I suspect that it is either ICH or Fin Rot. There is a chunk taken out of its tail. There are also several (5-7) white spots on the belly and the bottom of where the tail connects to the body. It keeps getting stuck to the filter. Is it contagious? I moved it to a tank with warmer water. The new tank is currently in the fishless cycle (just started). The Shubunkin fish is still perfect.
What should I do for both fish?
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05-15-2012, 04:29 PM, (This post was last modified: 05-15-2012, 04:30 PM by Ram.)
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RE: Suspected Disease
Don't jump into conclusion that fish is infected with diseases or parasites.
From your previous threads, we have learned that your fish are living in less than ideal, undersized, uncycled fish tank.


A single wet spot doesn't mean ich. If the fish has multiple of such white spots, then it can be ich. Only with a good photo we can tell for sure. Yes, ich is very contagious. Even if other fish in the same tank seem to be uneffected, ich parasites can hide in the gill.


You told us you just bought a slightly bigger tank, the 8.5 gallon. Why not transfer the fish into there? Fishless cycle can take up to 6~8 weeks to completely. Your fish won't be able to make it that long in the smaller tank. The bigger tank can't guarantee them to survive since it is not cycled yet, but the fish will have a better chance in there since both tanks are uncycled.
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05-16-2012, 01:24 AM,
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rwzheng1997 Offline
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RE: Suspected Disease
I am positive it is some sort of fungi. The comet died, and it turned completely white and fuzzy within 4 hours. I have already moved the Shubunkin (and comet) into the 6-8gallon tank (like 3 days ago). The tank that is doing the fishless cycle is a guppy tank (none yet). I heard ICH symptoms include lethargy. My Shubunkin seems to have moments of hour long lethargy, and then its up again. I am kind of fearful for my Shubunkin, because I never paid attention to the gills, but I think it may be slightly inflamed.
The comet looked a little like this: http://www.mypets.net.au/cache/2a90d8aab...350_sc.jpg

My parents think that I have too many fish tanks (2), so if I can somehow get rid of the small one (garage sale, craiglist, etc.) I might be able to buy a 30 gallon tank.
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05-16-2012, 03:45 AM,
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Thor Online
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RE: Suspected Disease
The fish died most likely due to ammonia poisoning, since you have a undersized tank without doing nitrogen cycle first.
After the fish dead, there is no immune system to stop fungus growing on the dead fish. Sometimes you will find a piece of left over fish food quickly grow fungus all over it within hours. It is the same concept here. Dead fish grow fungus doesn't mean the fish died because of fungus, it grew after the fish died.

The #1 ich/ick symptom would be white spots on the body, and the fish would "flash" to rub itself against objects because it is very itch.

If you show us a photo of your fish, we might be able to tell if it is ich or not, but you also need to know that ich doesn't kill fish that fast.

I strongly recommend you not to be paranoid over diseases. Wink Your number one concern should be getting the ammonia down.

For new fish tanks, I always recommend to use SeaChem Prime as water conditioner due to its ability to detoxify ammonia for up to 48 hours.
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05-16-2012, 08:39 AM, (This post was last modified: 05-16-2012, 08:50 AM by rwzheng1997.)
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RE: Suspected Disease
How long does it take to cycle a 8 gallon tank if there are two filter medias that are a about 4"x5" ? As for the water conditioner, would it be better to just use a solution of bacteria?
This is off topic, but what procedures do I need to follow to put in aquarium decorations. I bought this little house thing that looks like a aquarium decoration, but I got it from a dollar store, so I'm not sure if there are bad chemicles in it.
I heard that putting pennies a tank help fight Ich. I put in a penny, and I saw my fish stay near the penny for a couple of hours. Now, he seems to ignore the coin.
What is the best temperature for growing bacteria? I have one tank (the fishless cycling one) at 82 degrees Fahrenheit, and the other tank (the one with goldfish) at 72 degrees Fahrenheit. My local fish shop told me that I did not need a heater for goldfish.
Will Ich parasites harm the beneficial bacteria? If Ich is left in a tank (at 72/82 degrees fahrenheit) with no fish, shrimp, etc., then they will die within a week, right?

My sister already took the fish and buried it O_O (its her fish)
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05-16-2012, 05:58 PM, (This post was last modified: 05-16-2012, 06:09 PM by Ram.)
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RE: Suspected Disease
There is no fixed time for aquarium nitrogen cycling, because there is too much variable in everyone's tank.
Typical time for fishless cycling without heaving seeding can be up to 6~8 weeks. With heavy seeding from existing well established aquarium or Tetra SafeStart, could cut the cycling time down to anywhere from a few days to a few weeks. There is no fixed time.

Cycle with fish is slower.

Water conditioner and bacteria solution are two different things, and they serve different purposes. They are no substitute for each other.
Water conditioner neutralize chlorine in the tap water. Chlorine can kill the fish.
Bacteria solution (only Tetra SafeStart works), is to seed bacteria for new tanks to cycle faster.

I would suggest you to get both Prime water conditioner, and Tetra SafeStart, if the money is not an issue. Prime will help you to detoxify ammonia and nitrite, while Tetra SafeStart will help you cycle faster.
Of course, upgrade to a proper sized tank and filter is the most important.

You shouldn't use any decoration that isn't made for aquarium. Many of them have harmful chemicals in there which can be bad for fish.

If the tank has no fish, the best temperature for cycling would be in the high 80F. It can speed up the bacteria reproduction.
If you have fish in there, it is not recommended. Even for tropical fish, you should only go as high as middle 80F.
For goldfish, you may go as high as low 70F. They are not tropical.

Ich is a parasite. It has nothing to do with bacteria. If without a host (fish), ich will die off on its own within 2 weeks.
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05-17-2012, 10:12 AM,
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rwzheng1997 Offline
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RE: Suspected fish Disease
how do I test if a decoration is safe or not?
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05-17-2012, 10:15 AM,
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RE: Suspected fish Disease
There is no way to know for sure.
Just stay away from those decoration aren't made for aquarium. Most of them aren't fish safe. Even plastic plants are different from plastic aquarium plants in exactly material used. The former is not fish safe.
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